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bestworstcase · 16 days ago

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Anything from Volumes 1-3 that is setup that you don't think is given enough attention or respect for good setup?

Sidenote to this:

Open seat with no person in it + Salem having someone looking for the Choice Relic was hinting at Summer Rose. Did we have anything hinting at her pre Beacon's Fall or just things that she fits given additional context?

regarding summer specifically, while i wouldn’t call them hints per se, there are a handful of beats in v1-3 that smell like foreshadowing to me:

the first is “she was right about you; such arrogance.” – cinder might well be referring to salem here, of course. however. what strikes me about this remark is that arrogance is not a characteristic that salem seems to perceive in ozma; rather she describes him, in her soliloquies and songs, as a self-destructive, deceitful, manipulative fool blinded and trapped by his faith in the old gods. cowardly. fallen from grace. think of what she says to oz in 8.9—look how you’ve diminished, how you’ve lessened yourself—she sees him groveling at the feet of tyrannical monsters and sees debasement.

does it follow for salem to characterize ozpin to cinder as, primarily, arrogant? i’m not convinced it does. but summer rose? well… hm. consider, also, that the full line is “this whole time, right beneath our feet… she was right about you; such arrogance…” <- i think it is more likely than not that “she” is someone inside the brackets of “our,” and in context “our” is either [cinder + ozpin] or [cinder + her associates physically present at beacon].

in the event that “she” is not part of “our” the more naturalistic phrasing is “beneath our feet… salem was right about you” – because “she” otherwise has no antecedent. of course, some allowance here for this to be a narrative choice not to name salem yet, but we’re one (1) episode off from revealing her face and by this point we’ve known for a while that cinder works for someone else, so the choice to drop the name here or in the volume credits is of fairly trivial importance. unless of course cinder isn’t talking about salem.

second: “Oh! We've also stopped some bad guys, too! I guess it's like they say: "like mother, like daughter"! I still wonder why Ozpin let me into the school early…” [laugh track] – obv this part of ruby’s address to summer’s memorial headstone foreshadows ozpin’s conspiracy and team strq’s involvement therein. but it also foreshadows this exchange:

RUBY: We don’t have to kill you to stop you, and we will stop you. SALEM: Your mother said those words to me… she was wrong, too.

and i think it bears pointing out that ruby is wrong here, and later in the volume qrow specifically calls attention to this and lays out why she’s wrong. team rwby didn’t stop the bad guys; they cut off one avenue of attack and cinder circled around from a new direction that took advantage of torchwick’s imprisonment, and this also resulted in the public break between ozpin and ironwood which eroded the cohesion of the inner circle. ergo, ruby thinks she stopped the bad guys but in the long run the consequences of the breach all benefited salem.

looks into the camera like im on the office.

like mother, like daughter!!!

further, that sequence of events ultimately leads to the final confrontation between her and torchwick – wherein he declares “if you can’t beat them, join ’em,” and shortly gets eaten by a grimm right after making it clear that he intends to kill her. torchwick’s death is thematically motivated – a narrative rejection of his cynical every-man-for-himself, dog-eats-dog outlook – but consider that:

summer rose, if she is indeed salem’s willing agent, is certainly at beacon tonight – because she’d be the one who stayed behind to hold the fort.

summer is thus the one salem instructs to “reinforce our numbers at beacon,” meaning the grimm; that instruction only makes sense if the person receiving it can communicate with or command grimm. ergo, summer must have some degree of control over grimm.

ruby is disarmed and on the ground getting beaten by a man who fully intends to kill her, and a grimm swoops down out of nowhere to eliminate him faster than he can blinks. and then… the grimm rears up, roaring at her, and comes down with a sweep of its wings that creates a blast of air that pushes her away. that isn’t aggression!! that’s a defensive threat display!! (the feilong in v4 does the exact same thing – trying to push the boat away). it’s ruby who charges the gryphon, and while it lunges forward in reaction to her charge, all that happens is she gets her feet on its head and pushes off to leap over it, and the grimm goes fucking flying so hard it crashes into the ship’s interior and never emerges. the point being,

math.

it’s plausible that the grimm was drawn to torchwick’s murderous rage. but the way it behaves immediately after it swallows him – that very clear “get away from me please” body language, and ruby -apparently- kicking a grimm the size of a goddamned clydesdale dozens of feet and then through the hull of a literal warship? ruby is strong, but she’s not… that strong. but if the grimm didn’t want to engage her and propelled itself under and past her at the same time as she vaulted off its head? that would explain what happens perfectly – ruby’s kick altered its launch trajectory just enough that it crashed.

minutes later, someone loyal to salem scraped a very badly injured cinder off the top of beacon tower and left ruby alive where qrow would find her. salem’s vested interest in keeping ruby alive is VISIBLE throughout the battle for beacon, and notably include a perfect opportunity to capture her while she’s in a coma atop beacon tower that isn’t taken – suggesting that salem makes her singular attempt to capture ruby solely to reassure cinder that Something is being Done.

and if summer rose has command over grimm and was at beacon that night… the gryphon’s behavior is exactly what i’d expect if all the grimm had marching orders to insure this one girl in particular – the spitting image of their commander – doesn’t come to serious harm. there’s a nonzero chance that gryphon did in fact save ruby On Purpose!

…and that happens in the context of a fight between ruby and the bad guy she thought she stopped (but she was wrong), who joined salem because “if you can’t beat em, join em.” (salem voice) she was wrong, too…

also

<- like mother like daughter. summer had a nevermore’s eye view of the battle for beacon, in this essay i will –

third: this one is something i didn’t really Think About until v9 and specifically the v9 ost dropping, but some of the things cinder says in v2-3 strike me as like – she got that from summer im sure of it. for example, in midnight, cinder’s view of huntsmen is that they’re free, they have power, they can go anywhere and do whatever they want, and rhodes never contradicts this. where did she get “huntsmen and huntresses should conduct themselves with honor and mercy”? who taught her the aspirational moral ideal?

summer rose, maybe.

but in the deeper sense,

where did cinder get the ‘destiny’ conceit? her underlying beliefs about how the world is are a product of her childhood, but the overt framing of fate/destiny isn’t present in midnight; nor has salem ever spoken of destiny and her philosophical views are in many ways a rejection of destiny – salem does not believe in fate, she is the woman who dedicated her life to toppling the gods.

and on close examination this looks like yet another suspiciously summer rose shaped hole!! “you’re special, ruby […] special the way your mom was special […] it was said that those born with silver eyes were destined to lead the life of a warrior.” – in after the fall, ozpin gives coco an entire pep talk whose central conceit is embracing and submitting to the turns of fate – sacrifice “show them gods and deities/blind and keep the people on their knees” & guide my way “you were born to hypnotize them all/they all said their prayers/can you hear me up there?”

cinder, of pyrrha: “people assume she’s fated for victory, when she's really taking fate into her own hands. interesting. add her to the list.” & “it’s not about overpowering the enemy; it’s about taking away what power they have.”

<- that second statement is salem’s strategic doctrine, through and through. but the ‘power’ cinder is talking about here is derived through manipulating the perception of destiny; the self-fulfilling prophecy. the invincible girl cannot be touched because she makes subtle adjustments to insure that no one is able to try. it is pyrrha’s belief in destiny that destroys her, as it destroys ozma. ozpin invokes fate to justify and explain his choices. those born with silver eyes are destined to lead the lives of warriors.

summer rose was destined to live and die fighting the grimm – so the world promised her. maybe she believed, maybe she felt like she had no choice but to accept her prescribed fate. until she met salem, and took fate into her own hands. made a choice. broke the chains. it’s about taking away what power they have, like salem did when she tore the scales from summer’s eyes, like summer did when she refused her destiny and joined hands with the grimm instead.

what does summer rose look like through cinder’s eyes? she was a huntress. she was literally destined to be one of the greatest huntresses in history, a hero, the shining pillar upholding the world order that chose the enslavement of children as a fair price for peace. fate dictated that she be the icon, the idol, the embodiment of the system that brutalized and subjugated cinder – she had every privilege cinder could ever dream of, freedom and security and a home, a loving family – and she chose to walk away.

and if they talked about that like, ever, and specifically if summer talked about that warrior’s destiny as a cage, a curse she had to escape – is it any wonder that cinder would adopt that framing to make sense of what happened to her? if summer rose was fated to stand at the pinnacle, then does it not follow that cinder fall was fated to be ground into the foundations? and likewise, if summer rose can shatter her pedestal and fall from grace, then cinder fall can shatter her chains and rise. summer proves that the idea of destiny is powerful but not inviolate. and it is hollow, it is a lie, a fiction, and that means it can be taken away. revealed as a deception. destroyed.

anyway

to the broader question

i think people really, really do not give the jaundice arc enough credit for the long-term set up it’s doing.

(or the very overt textual statement from THE HISTORY PROFESSOR! placing the blame for the violent radicalization of the white fang squarely on human bigotry and persecution of faunus in general; the white fang arc is clunky and hamstrung by the inadequacy of its vocabulary, but the fandom talking point that the narrative perspective on this subject has “evolved” or “improved” is just. not true. v1 is very emphatically clear that 1. terroristic violence is not activism, 2. ascribing the terroristic violence of a few to an entire minority group to rationalize bigotry is bigoted in and of itself and completely unacceptable, and 3. violent radicalization is created through relentless discrimination and hate, which creates a self-reinforcing circle wherein the justifiable outrage of the persecuted outgroup and the extreme violent reactions provoked by the persecution are distorted into a justification for further persecution by those of the in-group who materially benefit from perpetuating this cycle!!! all of this is explained in an almost afterschool special manner by the main character faunus rights activist and the history professor!!! in volume one!!! what changed is that the writers developed the skill and vocabulary necessary to weave these ideas into their storytelling in a more effective and more cogent way!!! literally begging the rwby fandom to start listening to the actual words the characters say)

ahem. the jaundice arc lays so much of the groundwork for jaune’s and ruby’s character arcs reaching all the way to v9 and undoubtedly beyond; it sets up the first pieces of the ozlem fractal; it foreshadows the white fang arc and sets up blake’s character arc of self-reclamation and figuring out how she wants to use her voice as an activist; it draws attention to the misogynistic cultural norms that define and are defined by the history between ozma and salem; it lays the foundation for the scene in v2 where ozpin questions blake, which hits the way it does because we have the context of anti-faunus harassment occurring openly at ozpin’s school and nobody doing anything about it, and by extension is the first stroke of the salem-faunus connection that is almost certainly the keystone holding the entire narrative together because it is her relation to the faunus that provides the key to decipher the lost fable.

the jaundice arc is a crucial load-bearing pillar that supports the entire narrative and people revile it because nobody in this fandom can be fucking normal about jaune. lmao

#in general i don’t think rwby gets enough credit for how much gets set up in the first two volumes #or how well the dominoes falling in v3 is executed #like the fandom gets properly excited when things from v1-2 come to fruition but like #i think there’s a really strong tendency across the board to kind of #mentally compartmentalizing the beacon arc as this sort of #experimental prelude to the actual story. the writers figuring out how to write by trial and error #and by extension to treat these long game narrative culminations as just. ''callbacks''#or post-hoc stitching together from the raw material of the early volumes #when really it’s just. the story was planned out from the start! lol!#''oh but the maidens didn’t even exist until v3'' salem and cinder are in the first goddamned episode.#their narrative arcs were planned in advance but probably had a hole (like ‘what is cinder hoping to get out of this specifically’)#that was being actively workshopped while they worked on the first couple volumes #until someone came up with the idea that the keys to the magic vaults salem needed to open #could be people whose magic you can steal and that’s what cinder wants #this is how planning a story works you block things out roughly and refine more and more as you go!!!#ahh!!!!!#there is too much foreshadowing and critical setup in v1-2 for it to be anything but on purpose and planned #nobody has any business being surprised at this point when seeds planted in v1-2 sprout. and yet

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good-beans · 7 months ago

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this is so stupid but i always have fun imagining the milgram characters watching their own/others mvs and seeing their reactions, especially for MeMe

That’s not stupid at all, thank you so much for the ask!! It’s sooo interesting to think about! I planned on just posting this drabble, but the more I thought about it, the more I started jotting down headcanons for everyone 👀 Of course there’s the initial disbelief and shock that Milgram can really do what it claims, but once they accept that, they’d have a lot of interesting reactions…

Es gets to watch the video first, then the prisoners are free to watch their own in the privacy of the courtroom/extraction room/wherever. Other prisoners can watch them only with explicit permission from the video’s singer. No one is allowed to watch Undercover except for Es. At first they spend hours looking at those final frames of themself flinching from the camera, hoping to jog any sort of memories, but eventually they give up on it. While actually watching it, they don’t mind the murder silhouettes. While sleeping, however, it has triggered more than one nightmare.

Haruka: He thinks Weakness is very pretty – he’s amazed seeing himself on the screen and hearing his voice, knowing he’s not that good of a singer. Even before his innocent verdict, it gives him a huge surge of confidence. Once he gets to know the others better, he gives them mv permissions, then stares intently at their faces to see their reactions as they watch it. AKAA scares him a bit, seeing his own intense emotions on screen, and he only gives Muu permission to see it. When he’s alone, Haruka pauses the shots of his mother, just to stare for a while.

Yuno: Laughs at the symbolism her mind used in Umbilical. She’s never shied away from sexual words/thoughts, so it's funny the video was as tame as it was. She thinks the song is fun, and isn’t afraid to show the others and sing snippets of it around the prison. Some days it’s too emotional for her to get into it, but most of the time she tries to display a confident attitude about it. After Tear Drop, she’s satisfied with her anger and more overtly sexual images. If anything, she feels too exposed by the shots of herself looking more vulnerable/sad.

Fuuta: He experiences a solid mix of embarrassment at the gaming theme in Bring it On and feeling a surge of pride that he looks badass in the knight’s armor. He’s worried the warden won’t take him seriously with the video game obsession, but he absolutely loves the song and thinks it portrays his toughness and ideals well. He’s less thrilled with Backdraft, everything about it unsettles and embarasses him. He’s thrown by the shot of crossing out his own silhouette – he’d had self-harming thoughts, but wasn’t quite ready to confront them so blatantly yet. Like Haruka, he can be caught pausing the arcade shot just for a moment before turning the whole thing off and storming away.

Muu: She has mixed emotions towards After Pain. She hates seeing herself look so weak and pathetic, but it gives her a lot of hope that her story will be understood. She misses her friends, and seeing them again is bittersweet. She closes her eyes at the moment of the stabbing – she’s only gotten the courage to watch it through her fingers once. She watches INMF once, then refuses to look at it again from shame/horror. Despite Haruka’s begging, she doesn’t let him watch it, either.

Shidou: He asks Es what they saw in Throw Down. Upon finding out his family wasn’t in it, he chooses not to watch it. He believes he already knows all about his emotions and crime, so there’s no need to go through that pain again. He’s tempted to watch it when he’s confused about Es’ verdict, but still holds off. He does watch Triage when informed his family is in it. He spends hours in front of the screen by himself. Only after seeing that one does he watch Throw Down, though he’s still left confused about Es’ decisions.

Mahiru: Absolutely loves TIHTBILWY. She thinks it perfectly describes her situation, and that the song is very cute. She lets others watch it, and unlike Yuno, feels like singing it 24/7. It reminds her of her bf, and she thinks that’s very romantic. Similar to Shidou, she spends a lot of time watching I Love You just to look at her boyfriend. She shows it to everyone, just to show him off and talk about him, even if she does skip over the beginning and end each time.

Kazui: He is very similar to Shidou; he refuses to watch his videos until T2, assuming it would be too painful to watch something he already knows and wishes to avoid. Unlike Shidou, seeing Hinako is far too painful, and he regrets watching it and seeing her so happy on their wedding day. Though maybe he’s still waiting, and hasn’t seen any of the videos yet…

Amane: Magic makes her worry more than anything. She fears she’s poisoned by unnecessary vainness since so much of her video involves cute things, colors, outfits, animals, and is set up like a tv show. She’s also worried that Es and the others will really see her as a child because of how cute the whole thing is. She prevents herself from watching it too many times, but buried under all her fears, it gives her a surge of pride seeing herself so talented and pretty and the star of the show. Purge March only reaffirms her confidence in her crime – the video brings up some awful memories, but it shows her as a leader, a warrior, a hero! It brings her comfort and confidence more than anything.

Mikoto/John: The videos are distressing to both of them, and they spend all their time studying the others’ screentime. Mikoto watches in horror as John does things that line up with his spotty memories, and John panics seeing that his actions distress Mikoto more than they’ve reassured/saved him. John does end up watching his own scenes a few times – it feels incredibly good to appear in a way that Mikoto may finally notice him. He feels seen. Now, logically I think that MeMe would be the final tipping point in which Mikoto finally accepts the situation and his DID, but if I must stick to his canon denial, then I’d say he goes on a whole rant about movie magic andt the crazy things you can do with editing nowadays. He doesn’t have a good explanation on how Milgram found his home and knew so much about him, but he explains everything away as cgi or camera effects. Double manages to sway him a bit more, as he hears John speak so plainly to him. Just as the audience had some debate on who was apologizing at the end of Double, Mikoto and John wonder who is apologizing to whom. Though they both come to the conclusion it’s their own apology, they decide that if it was the others’, they’d accept it and forgive them.

Kotoko: She’s very pleased with Harrow, and is unashamed to show it to the others. Though she’d been able to watch a few of the previous prisoners’ videos, it still shakes her a bit when she realizes that Milgram really does have the tech to look deep inside her. She watches it just a few times – not obsessing over it, but not afraid either. Deep Cover, however, is a once-and-done sort of deal. She claims she’s not letting the others watch it because “they couldn’t handle such harsh but true criticisms about themselves,” but she doesn’t end up watching it anymore herself, either.

#milgram #es #haruka sakurai #yuno kashiki #fuuta kajiyama #muu kusunoki #shidou kirisaki #mahiru shiina #kazui mukuhara #amane momose #mikoto kayano #kotoko yuzuriha #thank you so much! and for being patient 😅#i didnt mean to take so long but i kept chipping away at ideas while i got to this one #these were so much fun to think about!! i went for more emotional ones here but i do have silly thoughts too #i have that silly post about them making a competition after seeing each others mvs #though -even if they dont make it outwardly a big deal like that #i think they definitely would silently compare their videos/crimes to each others and decide whose was better #i still stand by the fact that fuuta asks kotoko if shes a furry after seeing harrow sdfasdf #i cant imagine kazui allowing anyone in the prison to watch his but IF he did #fuuta would also ask if he was a furry after cat ADSFSADF #i think the reactions t1 would be pretty positive/comforting #but in t2 theres a lot less pleasantries and compliments #aside from the obvious deep insights the videos give i think theyd reveal a lot of sweet similarities #like appreciation for flowers or cooking or performance or video games or music genres #but by t2 everyones on edge and suspicious of each other #or ashamed themself :(#i think its really cool imagining who would want to share theirs and who would keep theirs private...#rose posts

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jonsnowunemploymentera · 7 months ago

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Something rubbed against his leg beneath the table. Jon saw red eyes staring up at him. “Hungry again?” he asked. There was still half a honeyed chicken in the center of the table. Jon reached out to tear off a leg, then had a better idea. He knifed the bird whole and let the carcass slide to the floor between his legs. Ghost ripped into it in savage silence. His brothers and sisters had not been permitted to bring their wolves to the banquet, but there were more curs than Jon could count at this end of the hall, and no one had said a word about his pup. He told himself he was fortunate in that too. His eyes stung. Jon rubbed at them savagely, cursing the smoke. He swallowed another gulp of wine and watched his direwolf devour the chicken. Dogs moved between the tables, trailing after the serving girls. One of them, a black mongrel bitch with long yellow eyes, caught a scent of the chicken. She stopped and edged under the bench to get a share. Jon watched the confrontation. The bitch growled low in her throat and moved closer. Ghost looked up, silent, and fixed the dog with those hot red eyes. The bitch snapped an angry challenge. She was three times the size of the direwolf pup. Ghost did not move. He stood over his prize and opened his mouth, baring his fangs. The bitch tensed, barked again, then thought better of this fight. She turned and slunk away, with one last defiant snap to save her pride. Ghost went back to his meal. Jon grinned and reached under the table to ruffle the shaggy white fur. The direwolf looked up at him, nipped gently at his hand, then went back to eating.

Jon I, AGOT

It's interesting that GRRM would dedicate several paragraphs to a seemingly unimportant exchange between a boy, his wolf, and an unfriendly third party. But there's just something about this passage that has continued to nag at me for years since I first read it because, considering how heavy handed GRRM was with the foreshadowing in AGOT, this feels important.

Jon is sitting at table full of squires - aka would be knights. We don't really know who they are or what families they belong to, but it's safe to assume that they come from a certain level of privilege; this is considering the fact that it cannot be financially easy to be a squire. And these boys already have a slew of tales detailing all their previous knightly exploits regarding "battle and bedding and the hunt" which suggests that they have some capital. So you have boys who will soon be men. And they will, presumably, become men of some power.

These lads eat their fill of the chicken until only half remains, which Jon then gives to Ghost. The direwolf's name is not so important here but what he represents is. Throughout the series, we're told that Ghost is reminiscent of the weirwood trees (because of his red eyes and white fur). He's stated to be of and from the Old Gods and since he's a personification of the weirwoods, he might as well be one of them. It's almost as if Jon is presenting whatever is left on the table to the Old Gods (Ghost). He lets them devour his offerings while he silently watches. And the motif of watching is so interesting here because it's kind of like Jon takes on a stewardship role - to watch over land/people/etc. He oversees Ghost eating the chicken, so he's overseeing whatever has been given to the Old Gods. This is not new imagery to his arc. As a brother of the Night's Watch and eventually its leader, we have several instances where he leads people to adopting the Old Gods in some fashion. In ADWD, several recruits swear their vows to the Old Gods while he watches on as their Lord Commander. The Old Gods are also primarily of the North and we're told that Jon has more of the north in him than his brothers; interesting that this also includes Bran. So perhaps whatever is being offered to the Old Gods relates to the North.

We must also note that Jon initially thinks to give only a small portion, a leg, before pivoting and providing the entire thing. It feels to me a bit like the process of carving up a kingdom or something similar. The lords (represented by the squires) take what they want and leave aside what they don't; or perhaps they have eaten to their fill and can take no more. Then when his time comes, Jon first considers a small piece of land/group of people before eventually absorbing all of whatever is left behind. The concept of carving up a kingdom rings harder considering that we have several callbacks to the ideals of kingship in this chapter. Robert, Jaime, Tyrion, and even Mance though we don't know it yet, all play into this. And then there's the aspect of Jon letting the chicken slip between his legs which evokes birth/fatherhood, a very curious choice when GRRM could've just had Jon place the chicken on the floor. So land/people are carved up and Jon then uses whatever is left to birth his own type of kingdom. And this kingdom is one for the Old Gods.

This also touches on something that has been quite prevalent throughout Jon's arc. It's the concept of accepting the "others" or "those left over" who live apart from the accepted social norms. Arya (a tomboy), Sam (a gender non-confirming boy), the Night's Watch (criminals, extra sons, and men who have no future left or place to go), and even the wildlings are all examples of this. And Jon takes on a leadership/paternal role to every single one of them. He looks after them as a leader would/should. Sometimes, in the case of Arya and the wildlings, he's equated to a king. He's a steward/shepherd/king. There's messianic undertones to this:

Come unto me, all you who are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light." (Matthew 11:28-30).

If you're familiar with Judeo-Christian tradition, you'll know that Jesus is often personified as one who spent the majority his time among the outcasts. The idea is that he came to save them too and that anew kingdom (or new earth depending on your translation) would spring up after the end of the world where he would forever rule as king; which presents the idea of a final king after the earthly ones are done away with. Now GRRM isn't so heavy handed with Christian allusions as other authors out there, but he does have a Catholic background and Jon is so overtly a Jesus figure. And in Revelation, Jesus is king and god at the very end....

One last thing: the mention of the mongrel who challenges Jon has always been rather interesting but confusing to me. A mongrel doesn't really relate to one specific type of dog. But it's interesting that Jon notes several roaming about where he is. They follow the serving girls who carry the food to be offered. Mongrels are used to describe antagonist/villainous groups in ASOIAF. Sometimes, they're used to describe slavers in Essos. But what's interesting is that most of the time, they're used to describe Euron's Ironborn especially in Victorian's POV. So I don't think the mongrel who challenges Ghost is a supernatural threat of death (i.e., the Others) but rather a human one. They represent those who are called to the scene once the lords have finished playing their games. It almost feels like a feast for (carrion) crows....

But it doesn't really matter because this mongrel isn't much of a challenge for Ghost. Though the mongrel is much larger, the direwolf is able to fend her off very effortlessly. Given that "mongrel" is used to describe Ironborn raiders, could this exchange between Ghost and the mongrel point to reavers or sea raiders who rise and fail challenge Jon kingdom? There is a historical King Jon Stark who did this....

When sea raiders landed in the east, Jon drove them out and built a castle, the Wolf's Den, at the mouth of the White Knife, so as to be able to defend the mouth of the river.[1][2] His son, Rickard, followed him on the throne and annexed the Neck to the north.

ref.

So this might shed some light not only on Jon's already published arc, but also on what we can expect in the future. We have some foreshadowing through Jon's ADWD dream that he will not only rise with the dawn (thereby live through the Long Night), but will be in a position to lead people (wildings in that chapter) to a new peace after a hard fought war. Also remember that the wildlings, rather enthusiastically, swear oaths to him as if swearing oaths to their king. In this instance, the supernatural (a dream of the war for the dawn) is followed by the natural/human. So perhaps this particular passage (and Jon's dream) can be used to predict that Jon comes out on top, and quite effortlessly too, as a leader. And he becomes a leader who rules by association with the Old Gods; or rules a kingdom for them.

To end, I think it's of note that this passage immediately precedes Jon's conversation with Benjen where he voices his desire to go out on his own - the hero's call to action. This is the adventure that's going to kickstart his growth as a man, warrior and most importantly, a leader. So it looks like before we even began, GRRM telegraphed how it would all end in just three short paragraphs.

#jon snow #asoiaf #valyrianscrolls #ghost the direwolf #some random extra thoughts:#the aspect of fatherhood is closely tied to kingship as kings are often regarded to be the fathers of their nations #so we might see a parallel where jon-like dany-doesn't have children of his own physical body #but rather rules a kingdom as its symbolic father #think of how odin-a mythical parallel for jon-is called the all father because he is father to all men/lands #also it's interesting to me how kingship is a theme but it's almost like the actual theme is that of kings coming of going #but jon remaining and prevailing above all #we have robert who is a disappointing/bad king and his rule doesn't last very long and neither will his dynasty #jaime looks like a king and even if grrm didn't go through with his original ideas he was never meant to rule for long #in the new story jaime is symbolic of rhaegar a would be king whose time comes and goes leaving jon to pick up the pieces #then tyrion who stands “as tall as a king” but not quite! he still is not as tall as jon and tyrion also says in a later chapter #that soon he'll be even shorter than ghost + tyrion wasn't hand for long #mance who is hidden also has his time as king but it's very short lived and jon later absorbs his kingdom to make his own #so we have the wolf devouring the “left behinds” in a way but the interesting thing is this happens in reverse doesn't it #might Jon's new kingdom not only be made of remnants of the nw and wildlings but also have those left behind from the rest of the 7k?#it's possible since jojen tells us that once night comes all cloaks become black 🙂#so yeah this is all just more jon endgame king of winter/a new north propaganda lmaoooo

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fromtheseventhhell · 10 months ago

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Arya and Dany stans: *discuss the likelihood that they'll have a positive relationship given their parallels, foreshadowing, status as key characters, and being two of George's favorite characters*

Stansas: Is this Sansa shade?

I think it's hilarious that Stansas got mad at me for (accurately) pointing out that they accuse Arya and Dany stans of being motivated by Sansa hate simply because...we get along and like both of them lol. The idea of them getting along is about their characters and has nothing to do with Sansa. Just because they pit Dany and Arya against each other for Sansa's sake doesn't mean we're motivated by the same thing. Are there some conversations that bring up Sansa + Arya's strained relationship? Absolutely, that isn't baseless in the books considering they're written as foils and George has already said they have issues they need to work out. The "Stark sisters 4ever" fantasy they have is just that, and it's funny we never see this same energy for Arya being turned into a prop for her sister 🤔. Sisterhood didn't stop Sansa from siding with Joffrey, telling Cersei that Arya was a traitor (even though she had no idea where Arya was), or calling Arya unsatisfactory when she thought that she was dead so why are we supposed to pretend it's an all-important factor when discussing Arya's potential relationships with other characters?

#arya stark #daenerys targeryan #anti sansa stans #fandom forever talking about how the sisters writing is misogynistic but when we acknowledge that conflict it's an issue #yes Arya loves her sister but that doesn't mean all of their issues are going to magically disappear when they reunite and this is somethin #we were explicitly told by the author! guess we're supposed to just ignore what he said cause it doesn't fit fanon though #this idea that we're constantly thinking about Sansa and forming our opinions to spite her is so insane I can't #we can't even like two female characters without it being turned into a conspiracy theory 😭#the real issue is that they can't stand that we talk about Arya as her own character and not just a prop for Sansa #cause where's this energy for the Stansas and /supposed/ Arya stans who come together to hate on Dany??#or for the ones who erase Arya's entire story and mold her into a prop whose only purpose is to serve Sansa?

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sendmyresignation · 9 months ago

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i truly think nearly every my chem song has more than one meaning (this is true of most things) but also that many of those meanings are contradictions and thats the point because that's the heart of my chemical romance: an enterprise which is both fake shrouded costumed performed and also the most genuine thing on planet earth

#this is to say wttbp was born to be the anthem which is itself selfaware of the fact its not enough n also somehow the most important thing #like you have to have the dualities of death and grief in your mind i think to grasp that.#and that the anthem cannot full explain all of it but man. the world will never take my heart.#you dont have lines like that in a song commited to complete subversion #bc my chem have never been a band with flights of detatched 90s irony or cynicism. even at their most bleak. yknow.#like not to be too stark about it. but this is a song about death by someone whose witnessed death #by someone whose experienced deep personal grief #and by someone whose been honest about viewing death as an escape. at one point.#and all those threads are important... the idea of death as something which can feel like propaganda......#anyway wttbp song of all time #my posts

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akikos-tribble-army · 1 month ago

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Mori should have more anatomy models in his office. He's a doctor, where is the random skeleton in the corner? The eye model on the desk? The heart on the shelf? The half open body where the organs always fall out when you look at it? The skull where everyone wants to ask if it is real, bc dude is a mafia boss, you never know?

#watch me pull out the vertebra cups for cosplay reasons once again #let me also get out the old hip and knee model #also the stethoscope #yes I have a stethoscope #I am out of scalpels though #Mori could be so much more unhinged just by having that random skull on his desk #like it's not real but his people don't know that #he's hiding sweets in the skull #every time someone dares to ask whose skull that is #he just answers that it's an old friend and that's it #no explanation just an innocent smile that unsettles you even more #and then he proceeds to open it #turn it around and to ask if you want sweets #like it's the most normal thing in the world to store sweets in a random skull #Kouyou and Chuuya are the only ones who know the truth about the skull #Dazai too bc he had the idea to store the sweets in the skull #bsd mori #bsd mori ougai #port mafia #bungou stray dogs #bsd #bsd mori headcanon #akikos shitpost #late night shitposting #it's like a social experiment for him #watching the reactions of everyone #some think it's a test of some sorts #but in reality it's just Mori being bored and looking for some entertainment

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juni-ravenhall · 9 months ago

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sso loading screen text "remember that knowledge is power".... imagine the power if the writers knew the lore of the game

#no offense to the likely 1 sse employee doing their best with actual lore but the way they changed bonnys writing was insane and #all the retconning and random shit like when scott was randomly generic evil man in some josh quest #and the shitty dialect things in general like rowan bc that shit doesnt even translate to other langs well its both badly written and not -#- even a good idea whatsoever for a multilanguage game that isnt just in english from the start. but also its just stereotypical and bad #bonny was written charming and interesting and it was really unnecessary to retcon her into this scottish stereotype dialect #and while sometimes they do bring proper stuff from the existing lore like devils gap and turn it into something... theres still-#- a million things that couldve been done better both in the current writing and the old writing as well! it was always a mess #like the ice wraiths of golden hills or whatever theyre called. the dino valley yeti and witch stuff being hinted but abandoned. etc #but they shouldve gotten someone to *read* all that and take notes and try to turn it into something good and more complete.#rather than getting ppl going lol lets change lots of stuff around it will be great (proceeds to make it worse)#disclaimer idk whose fault all of that is but i blame johan sjöberg for being a bad manager of this games potential and #also the whoevers that have had any power to direct and plan and manage shit at that company

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invinciblerodent · 10 months ago

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how do property laws work in Faerûn

no really, legally speaking, how can Rolan just take over Ramazith's tower? because on paper, all that happened is that adventurers waltzed into a home, killed the owner, and then... the apprentice, whose name -let's face it- is probably not on any sort of paperwork whatsoever, decided that he just owns the building and the land now? in the Upper City, the rich-tits district of Baldur's Gate where all the patriars live?

how do wizard apprenticeships even work. is it like regular employment, an unpaid internship, or Some Guy just hangs out in your home until you decide they've learned enough. was Lorroakan just being an asshole, or actually breaking Fantasy Labor Laws.

or is it just wizard laws. are wizard laws not like regular laws. do you just get anything your opponent owns if you best them in a wizard-duel. can (should????) you bring backup to a wizard-duel, or is it considered bad form to use help that's not your apprentice or someone you summoned yourself. is it illegal, or just a bit of a dick move to bring a ticked off aasimar AND a wizard that's a higher level than yourself as backup.

I have so many questions and no answers whatsoever, but I bet there will be a slightly uncomfortable conversation about this among the rebuilt council that ends with "do you actually, honestly miss Lorroakan enough to try and figure this out, or can we just fucking drop it and be glad he's dead"

#glitch plays bg3 #baldur's gate 3 #rolan #lorroakan #my partner did that fight yesterday #and last time i got there unfortunately Rolan hadn't been around #so I wasn't THINKING about it because I left the property empty #but now I AM thinking about it #it'll be really really funny when I get to this part with Iona because I love the idea of a powerful sorceress and an archwizard #just showing up flanking the apprentice who's pointing at the guy like #“this is the dick who punched me. get him”#and they've not only brought an aasimar- they brought their LAWYER #(whose legal knowledge is 200 years out of date)#(we don't mention that)#i can't even decide who the funniest fourth member is to this party #but I AM leaning towards the high harper of baldur's fucking gate #squirrel plays bg3

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imminent-danger-came · 1 year ago

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Anyone else absolutely allured by how wrong everyone in lmk is all the time. Everyone is an unreliable narrator and no one knows what's going on or what they're doing. It makes it so fun for me

#like normally you have a gut feeling whose right and whose wrong but lmk literally throws that out the window #like in 3x06 it's like okay. So DBK is telling the truth right let's get it #AND HE LITERALLY ISN'T. THE UNBIASED ACCOUNT IN 3X10 IS DIFFERENT #you can't even trust the shit people show you in the scroll of memory. Azure lied #Like hello #We didn’t even get the full story with Macaque in 4x11.#like oh my GOD nobody tells the truth here it's invigorating #Like literally no one #they are living up to the ''no one has any idea what they're doing'' theme #I love it sm #lmk #lego monkie kid #lmk rant #imp tag

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hadesknockedupintheunderworld · 6 months ago

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Bout to muse about something that is part headcanon part canon events

ㅤ

Tails is finally saved from his bullies by the (currently) small time hero he admires

Tails stalks follows his hero, uses his mechanical knowledge to improve Sonic's plane

While Tails follows Sonic around, even on dangerous journeys, the hedgehog keeps an eye out for the younger fox behind him, keeping him from being in too much danger

Sonic leads by example, demonstrating to Tails how to fight, and Tails runs maintenance on Sonic's plane and teaches him how to read

Soon enough, they become softly inseparable. Even if they can't adventure side by side (although they do more often than not), Sonic keeps contact with Tails whenever he can.

They strengthen each other's weak points. Where Tails lacks in raw strength, Sonic makes up for it with experience and speed. Where Sonic lacks in firepower, Tails has a machine, a gadget, or the technical know-how to take one. Sonic often rushes into danger, fighting without thinking too hard, but Tails' specialty is strategizing or making plans, and he's one of the few who can slow Sonic down enough to make sure he's prepared. And where Sonic supports Tails by being a force of nature, someone who can roll with the punches and execute one of Tails' plans with complete trust or faith, Tails also supports Sonic by understanding what he cannot, by crafting plans when Sonic is at a loss for how to proceed. They have such unwavering faith and trust in each other's abilities now.

Where Sonic is a hero, Tails is his own kind of hero, saving the people only he can save, helping in the ways only he can help. They support each other. They look out for each other. Even if Sonic is a force on his own, or Tails can go on solo adventures, they're more effective when they're together.

And no matter how things change as they grow, the people who come and go, the two of them are a constant. Sonic and Tails, ever at each other's sides.

#sonic the hedgehog #sontails #unbreakable bond #miles tails prower #tails the fox #i just be ramblin #Sorry they just make me emotional and insane #Although really the only thing that's solidly a headcanon and not either canon or my reading of them is that Tails teaches Sonic how to read #Despite them being 'hero and sidekick' I always like to think that as they grew (both up and closer to each other) and as time passed #they maintained this push and pull. They slotted into place as partners that support each other and help where the other falters #And really no matter what happens relationship wise or life wise with the two of them‚ I can only imagine that they still live and fight #together #Tails could get married and Sonic would still crash at his place and Tails would still keep food for him #Sonic could get married and/or have a kid with someone and Tails would move right in with them (if they don't just straight up stay with #Tails)#No matter what happens I can never see them not at each other's sides #And of course I like the idea of Tails starting out a bit more codependent but ultimately someone who works to support Sonic so he can #continue to be needed/wanted and be at his side‚ while Sonic‚ who initially believes that he let Tails into his life and is protecting him‚#grows more secretly codependent. I think Tails is aware of how important Sonic is in his life (even if Tails has interests and wants and #whatnot outside of him)#while Sonic is...the kind of guy who believes that he chooses to keep Tails by his side‚ but whose world would also begin to crumble if #Tails disappeared (and I think Sonic Prime gives me pretty good ammo with that)#Gaaaaaah they just fascinate me. they fascinate me🥺😭💖

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lord-squiggletits · 8 months ago

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One of my least favorite parts of how JRO wrote Optimus is that he wanted so badly to continue his dark and gritty world building making the Autobots problematic, but evidently couldn't reconcile this with Optimus being a Heroic Paragon, so instead he leaned way too hard into "oh Prowl was the one who did this and it was behind Optimus' back" which if anything I think makes Optimus look worse, not better. Because then it's like, okay I know Optimus trusted Prowl a lot as his friend but you CANNOT TELL ME that over the course of 4 million years, Optimus as the leader of the Autobot army who literally would have access to 99.9% of all the records they produce, would never notice or question where some of these odd/inconsistent details were pointing. It just seems really inconsistent with how a real military would actually function, especially regarding Optimus' character, who is incredibly thorough and responsible and wouldn't neglect to keep up with all the details of his army.

Hell, Optimus knows who the Wreckers are and had them on call for tricky operations when he needed them (Stormbringer) so he's literally not at all ignorant of/averse to the use of special wartime units composed of dubious individuals. He's the fucking commander of an entire army, of course he knows that War Is Hell (TM) and no one's hands are clean. That's not even getting into all the stuff he got up to in phase 2/3, I mean everything from the annexation of Earth to OP breaking humans out of prison against Council orders shows that Optimus is no stranger to immoral and/or unlawful means.

It also leads to a lot of annoying fanon where people write Optimus (sometimes unintentionally, sometimes not) as like some sort of ignorant fool who's unaware of the machinations of his own army or has some sort of naiveté of "b-but we can't use bad tactics against the enemy! I would never condone the use of morally gray means in war!" No, IDW Optimus knows perfectly well all of the bullshit he's enacted/condoned for the sake of trying to win the war. Some stuff is definitely out of character for him and was only machinated because of Prowl, but I think this fandom REALLY underestimates Optimus' personal agency/responsibility as the commander of a whole ass army and ESPECIALLY underestimates Optimus' capacity to condone morally gray Bullshit Of War while still being a good person individually as well as, comparatively, the lesser evil compared to Megatron/the Decepticons.

Anyways what I'm saying is JRO may be a good writer but he's really hesitant to make Optimus morally gray and does some asspulls sometimes to justify most of the bad things the Autobots did as "Optimus just didn't know," and since the majority of the IDW1 fandom only reads JRO's stuff they go running with this premise of ignorant/uninformed Optimus when there's evidence elsewhere in canon to show that Optimus is, in fact, very highly aware of the bullshit he's allowed "for the greater good" and the only stuff he was "unaware of" was the stuff he would literally never agree to the ethics of, like bombing innocent neutrals disguised as Decepticons to get them to join the Autobots.

#squiggposting #idw op love #i feel like part of the issue is that for a franchise whose entire premise is war #i feel like a lot of this fanbase. hasnt actually read a lot about war (fictional or nonfictional)#bc a lot of ppl here really seem to struggle with reconciling OP as a good person and OP #as a war leader who had bad things happen under his rule #and bc they dont know much about war in fiction or IRL they treat this as like. one extreme or the other?#when like if ur someone whos read a lot of war literature it's very easy to comprehend both of these as being true #like idk i think the 'OP was ignorant' defense isnt even how being a commander works #but it's also a cop out to make OP less interesting/morally gray than he could be #like idk how to explain that war is an inherently corrupt/immoral institution where in pretty much all of history #the act of waging war in itself is a moral compromise. war is literally about killing more of the other side than they do you #you are treating human life (and society and gov and the environment) as tools for victory #no matter how righteous your cause is or if you follow rules of engagement you literally are going to do bad things #so like this idea the fanbase seems to have where they like. want OP to be sheltered/ignorant of these realities #is SO not how reality works and wouldnt ever be in character for like 99% of optimi #i'm still trying to pull together my thoughts on this sorry the tags are so incoherent

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